Are Networking Referral groups Dead? Tammy Urbach explains how to maximize and craft your best 30 second commercial and 10 minute presentations. Learn how she delegated responsibilities to grow into a massive movement for small business.
Are groups worth it since so many focus on internet marketing? In 2010, Why and How did she create an entirely new Networking Referral Groups Organization when in reality there are several established nation and worldwide groups to begin with? Her group is 4br.biz and stretches across the entire Front Range of Colorado (aka Fort Collins to South Denver). After listening to this interview (stay tuned to the end of it) you can find out how to expand this model to a state and community near you. Especially if you find yourself not finding open slots for your profession but really love the idea of weekly networking groups to build a referral based business.
We all hear people talking about “delegating” and she has a great story of how her role as head moderator to all groups has turned into having district managers and other people supporting and running the meetings. It’s fascinating to see advice actually being implemented as well as the pitfalls to look out for and the keys to success.
ELEVATOR PITCH / 30 Second Commercial: we dive deep into making one that is memorable, conversation starting and the reasons why she dedicates specific time and open critique for new members to really flesh theirs out.
How do outside relationship building activities in the group translate into more Referrals being received and given each week?
Relational vs Transactional business. Her goal is business training and professional development.
Dynamics of the groups change because members change, expect that.
Sometimes one category of business opens up and someone takes their place. How do you gain the trust of the group so they start referring to you instead of the person who left?
When is it okay to be #2 and how patience is the virtual that wins?
Did you remember that site MEETUP.com ? Well its alive in well with this group/organization in finding new members. Are groups worth it since so many focus on internet marketing?
Why do all these groups cost money?
She has a dynamite way to make your 10 minute presentation EPIC for those in attendance.
She found that if she doesn’t put time on her calendar for HerSelf, then that time will still happen, but at an inconvenient time… like getting sick a few days before a major deal proposal.
Her morning routine involved coffee delivered in bed and catching up on Current Events.
BOOK: Magic of Big Thinking
Show notes can be found at www.adoctorsperspective.net/74 >here you can also find links to things mentioned and the interview transcription.
Justin Trosclair 0:02
Episode 74 networking referral groups to maximize them. I'm your host Dr. Justin trust Clara and today we are Timmy perspective.
Joint 2017 podcast Awards Nominated host Dr. Justin Foursquare, as he gets a rare to see him look into the specialties, all types of doctors and guess plus marketing, travel tips, struggles, goals and relationship advice. Let's hear a doctor's perspective.
Hey, everybody, welcome back to the show. I hope the last few episodes have been really good for you. I know we had a little marketing series, we finally got our dentist on and we'll even have an optometry Marketing Group here in the next week or so. But this week, hold on all this internet marketing talk did we forget about networking groups, you remember those the chamber be and I and this one for br Well, this is somebody I've met. And I've been knowing since man, the first year I've been in practice, so over a decade, and I joined her networking group, and she created it herself because of the necessity. And we talked about that. And we're going to learn some tips on your elevator pitch. So regardless of if you do networking groups are not referral groups, you know, they meet every morning or at lunch. And there's one profession represented per group. So if your groups taken, there's no more like chiropractors, you got like, create your own group or figure something out.
So the elevator pitch, hugely important. So we go into the elevator pitch, learn a few things. They're great tips for a 10 minute presentation that you can utilize in regardless of the type of group that you're in ways that she actually finds new members. So if you are part of a networking group, and you're like, Man, it's always hard to find like, guests and things he's got a nice tip for that works well for her 95% of her desk Come this way. It blew me away. And of course, there's free groups and there's big groups, why would you do a paid group and because she's been doing it for so long, she's actually ready to expand out of her area. So that interest you stay tuned to the end of the episode when I asked that question.
Hey, if you happen to have checked out the needle is acupuncture site, you know, wow, it's kind of confusing. Well, the the for downloads, I revamped that page. So a doctor's perspective. NET slash in a protocol. I revamped it, I made it easier. Let me know what you think it should be much easier to navigate. No, no up sales is just it's just email. Next Page downloads are available. And then from there, if you wanted to get you know, things that you'd actually need to stimulate the acupuncture points, you can click a button and it'll take you through that way. So trying to make it easier, a little bit less confusing. That's what it's about. You gotta test figure out what's going on and trying to make it work as always appreciate you listening has continued to show all the show notes can be found at a doctor's perspective. NET slash seven for let's go hashtag behind the curtain.
Live from China and Colorado. Welcome to the podcast yet again. Today's guest I've had the opportunity to spend at least a year maybe even closer to two years with with her amazing networking group in business development called for be our Her name is Tammy Urbach, welcome to the show.
Thanks, Justin. It's awesome to be here. And hello to you in China. This is cool.
Justin Trosclair 3:21
Oh, yeah. Well, y'all, this is her first podcast. So y'all Take it easy on her, and I think it's gonna be awesome. No hate mail. No, just kidding, she's gonna be good. There's no reason to have hate mail. So one thing that she has is I hate to call out the chamber. But let's just be honest, sometimes we're not happy with what we get out of our membership. And I'm sure we've all been to these networking groups where you got one profession represented in a circle at some restaurant, and you're saying what you do, and you're trying to pass leads and pass referrals.
And it gets
Justin Trosclair 3:52
kind of frustrating, right? They're not working. I walked in, and it seemed like they already had some money they liked are there already, buddy, buddy? And it's hard to like fit in. So Tim, how did you determine like you needed to create your own networking group? And do you even call it a networking group these days? What was the catalyst to form that?
Well, back when I started for VR was in 2010, I was actually a financial advisor at the time. And the first for VR group really came about out of my own personal need to get into some sort of a leads group or a referral group so that I could help build and grow my client base. And you know, you talk about the business category exclusivity that you mentioned briefly. And that's what I ran into that everywhere I went, my category was not available. And so that left me going, Well, how do I fix this? And then I'm like, well, I've been in groups, I've run groups, I've been in serious ones not so serious one. And I think I'm just going to start my own. And so that is what I actually did, started out my very first group in October of 2010, with eight members, and just kind of took off from there. It's been really interesting to see it evolve. And where are you at now? And it's been it's been a Scott, let's call it seven years. Where are you at now? So currently now so again, I'm only in Colorado at this time that I have groups all the way from four columns, the Loveland to Boulder to Lakewood, getting ready to launch Arapahoe County, and then we are also east by 25 inches Northland in Thornton. So, pretty much the the Colorado Front Range north to south and just really haven't gone to Colorado Springs yet.
Justin Trosclair 5:45
Yeah, that's, that's a drive
yet. And that would be one that I'd have somebody else do?
Justin Trosclair 5:50
Yeah, because you are going to like every single meeting as the head moderator so that these groups meet the agenda.
Correct. And that has began with that evolution of growing, it's my vision is to grow, then I can't reasonably be and all these places every day at all the different meeting times. So over the course of the years, we you know, I've got good well trained group leaders that are in those roles for a year at a time. And again, as I'm working on the growth plan, I have established territories where I have territory managers. And their role is to get a group started working as a group leader, and then develop a group leader for that group, and then to move on and start another one. So their their responsibility is to grow that territory. And I currently defined that by counties. So like Larimer, and weld county is a territory for one of my managers. And then I got somebody else that has Boulder County and another two gals that are responsibility for Arapaho and Jefferson counties. So it kind of starts to create the the hierarchy. And then, you know, my role is not only to run the organization as a whole, but is to support those group leaders and territory managers. And now I rotate in once a quarter or so, you know, just so that the organization still have contact and reach with me, they always know who who started it, who I am, because they obviously get the voicemails and emails, and they see me at event.
But it's been important to build that growth, prod product process, so that you know, how you're going to grow and how the interactions go and how you keep everything working the same in every group, because that's the one thing that I tell people is that the group meetings themselves should never be any different. The only difference from meeting to meeting or group to group should be the personalities in the room.
Justin Trosclair 8:00
Yeah, and we've all been part of these groups where they can morph into their own thing, if they're long established, or there's some kind of weird dynamic in one group, they start adding things are taking things away, and you're like, wait, wait, wait, these were there for a reason. Let's Let's have a back to back to basics, boot camp or something.
Yeah. And occasionally, you have to do that. Because that is one of the dynamics of having groups in an organization of this size is that you will, from time to time get people who want to run things the way they want to. And for duplication. Again, that can't work. Because if a person's experience isn't the same, with the exception of personalities, then you'll have groups that will fail, and you'll have groups that will flourish. And so it's kind of a tight control that still have to be in place in order to keep the balance equal. And to keep all of the groups in a in a good state of mind.
Justin Trosclair 8:55
When I was a part of the group, there was a huge emphasis on developing your elevator pitch that 30 seconds, what do you do, that it's not going to just bore somebody to tears. And, you know, but educate somebody so that they can maybe you want to do a private meeting. Or if you're at like a bigger event, you can use this, this pitch, get conversation flowing with somebody else that you've never met without being too like, pushy or whatever. What are you stressing in these elevator pitches? And is there a way for us to be able to brainstorm one for ourselves, even if we're not be able to be a part of this for VR group?
Well, you know, it's interesting. So again, I reference that I have been in many different types of groups over the years in my, in my here in my history of networking. And the challenge with the 32nd commercial or the elevator pitch, or whatever you want to call it is again, people have their own mindset of how they think that should be, some people think it should just be done on the fly. Other people want to be able to change it up from one week to the next week. Some people want to throw in a story. And, again, it depends on the group. And it depends on the organization, in the structure that I've created, my members learn and develop a 32nd commercial with the help of their fellow group members. And our purpose is to deliver the same commercial weekend week out so that you know it so well, that it falls out of your mouth without you ever even thinking about it. And what that does, is it allows you to be anywhere. And to always be prepared to talk about what you do, and always sound polished, and always sound professional. Because if you've ever done much networking, you know that you've come up and you've talked with people and two minutes later, they're still talking and you have no idea what it is they even do because they are just rambling. They don't have a plan. And I have found that my members can confidently go into any situation. And whether it's talking to an individual one on one, or talking in a group of 50 people, or finding yourself at a chamber event like I did want 125 people in a gigantic circle with a microphone, all doing a 32nd commercial, wow. And my members are equipped for that. But I knew when I was in that environment that 95% of the people in that room, were ready to puke because they were so nervous. And on top of that, they weren't listening to a single thing that anybody else was saying because they were so in their heads, thinking about what they were going to say when it was their turn with the microphone, that they didn't have the ability to even hear any of those other commercials. So, you know, we've created that great environment where Yeah, some people get stopped, and they get tired of doing the same commercial over. While we give them the opportunity to change it up, you want to go back into learn mode, you want to go back into redevelopment, and work on a new version, we can do that. But consistently week to week, we keep the same for all those reasons.
Justin Trosclair 12:18
What is I was recently been involved with something called story brand. And their whole thing is they have like a three step formula like you should you know, asking a certain question like they should be would like load your website, for instance, and be able to say what they do what you do what you want them to do within like a sentence and a half or you know, two sentences, it was a pretty, pretty amazing little program that they have that I've noticed. Do you happen to have like a basic formula that we should stick to or art something maybe to avoid in the 32nd commercial?
Well, we try to very cleanly avoid lingo, you know, brand lingo, industry lingo, because that doesn't mean doesn't mean to others what it may mean to you. And we also find that some people who have been in their businesses a really long time, sometimes they don't even know what they say about their business anymore, because they're so in it, that they don't have any idea what the perception is when they even talk about what it is that they do. So we try to avoid what I like to call them laundry list. So you don't stand up and go I sell insurance life, home auto business, property and casualty umbrella. You know, that's a laundry list. And after the first few things, people quit listening. Yeah. So yeah, I mean, you just you just tuned it out. And especially if you heard that list every week, you'd be like, I'm not listening to you anymore. It's not even interesting. Yeah. So you know, we always try to create something that's unique, helping them create a tagline that's super memorable. And it's typically just a few words, and it can be inserted anywhere in their commercial. But that's really a good way for you to stay in front of other people's minds. As long as their minds are open. When they're out in their daily world. They'll hear the opportunities based on remembering your tagline and they'll go, you know what, I have somebody you need to talk to you, I hear your problem. And I've got somebody that I know that can help you with that. You know, that's what they specialize in. In fact, this is their tagline. And then, you know, you're repeating that, that tagline to them. And so there's already like a familiarity when you make that referral, that not going to be great, because Wow, I was just talking about this. And now all of a sudden, he's got a solution for me. And I already know a little bit about this person, even if it's only a couple of words, that is automatically a warm transfer in that referral process. So those, you know, kind of little tips and tricks within that 32nd commercial is very beneficial on the group group members, again, they're helping their fellow members work through that process, and they've already been through it themselves. So they know how to how at times it can be challenging to work through. But how that finished product is so awesome, because you can just see the look on guests faces when they hear these polished professional commercials. And they're like, wow, how did you learn to do that?
Justin Trosclair 15:25
Because I remember the product. It's embarrassing, like you think you have a great one. And then you tell it to a group of 20 people and they look at you like how many how much critique do you want? Because everybody here can rip it because
these, like this was amazing. Like, yeah, but it's not amazing. Tell me what is your tagline.
And my tagline for for VR is that we are a personal and professional growth community.
Justin Trosclair 15:53
And if you don't mind, can you drop us the 32nd commercial?
Sure. It's actually I will tell you the truth. It's 20.
And it was a 22nd? Well, mine is everybody don't tie me and they'll go That was 20 seconds. I'm like I know it's been 20 seconds for about seven years. But yes, absolutely. Hi, my name is Tammy are back and I am the CEO and founder of for VR. for VR is evolving business development where all ages, all professions and all levels of experience, join together in a shared desire to be better and do more respecting your level of accomplishment or we are here to help you build a better business by referral. I'm Tammy Urbach with store br a personal and professional growth community.
Justin Trosclair 16:35
There we go.
There you go. Wait a second, did you time it?
Justin Trosclair 16:41
Sure, sure. I have a timer right there on my Skype account.
Justin Trosclair 16:46
That's crazy. That's what I remember most of what you just said from way back when that's wild.
And that's the part of the process. And that's why that consistent delivery of the same commercial over and over again, is that important? Because it will stick with people when it comes to referral time it works.
Justin Trosclair 17:05
So let's go with this. That's this dive deep. Part of the reason I had you on was, I want people to know that these groups work. They pass referrals, you can get business from it. And that's an option. I don't know if if you're looking to expand into bigger states. But other people might be listening to this and say, yeah, every group I'm in, there's always a chiropractor. There's always like a physical therapist, there's always a massage therapist, I don't know what else to do. So yada yada. In your group, when you pass referrals, what can somebody expect, and what's the way that people can maximize their networking experience so that not only the giving referrals, but they're getting referrals on a consistent basis.
So I tell everybody, pretty much you're going to get what you give. And if you're not involved, or example, if you just show up at your meeting every week, and you're really not engaged, the referral world isn't going to work with very well for you because everybody's there, because they're looking to grow their own businesses, and they're looking to help others grow. So if all you do, for example, as a tender weekly meeting, and you participate and no other fashion, it's going to be difficult for that referral process to happen naturally. In my organization, we really focused on relational development, where your relationships are developed to a very high degree. And that causes referrals to work naturally, as opposed to being forced to because that's what the rules of your group say you have to do. And what I mean by that is, it's one thing for us all to interact professionally in a weekly meeting. But in my organization, we also start to bring our inside circles, meaning our family, our kids are close associates into the outer circle of these people that you meet with. And as you start to learn more about the things that one another care about the things that are important to them, their family, their causes. When you start to learn and develop that level of relationship with people, that referral process does happen, naturally, and everybody benefits on all sides from that equation. You know, I, I joke all the time about a member that we had, who had thrown out an impromptu happy hour on Facebook, that we were going to just go go to happy hour and join us if you like. And, you know, a couple of months later, we're at a different event and somebody is talking about this happy hour event. And her husband was like, Well, why didn't I know about this? And she said, Well, I wasn't available to attend, he's like, but I know these people and I like to drink beer I was available to go. So you know. So when I talk about webbing, which I'll reference from time to time, those relationships start to happen, and they don't have anything to do with the primary members. This member knows this spouse and this spouse is this spouse, and all of a sudden their referrals happening that aren't even within the group, it's, you know, my husband going, Hey, there's somebody in your group that does, you know, carpet repair, and somebody in my office, that another dog chewed some stuff up, and they the carpet repair, can you give me that person's name. So those referrals start to really stretch, and they go all over the place and into all these different spheres, that starts to connect because of our focus on relational development, as opposed to transactions. You know, my experience with, you know, just a transactional relationship is that when one of you leaves the group, that transaction and because there's not really a relationship centered around that, it was, well, I'm going to do business with you. And you're going to do business with me, because we're in this group. And this is this thing that we're supposed to do.
Justin Trosclair 21:08
What happens when there's an established group for let's say, two years, they've had a
beauty line person in there, and they leave, they're like, well, either dumb, too busy, or they didn't like the group or whatever they didn't, they didn't stick around and a new person comes in it. How does that new person gain the trust of the group so that they stopped sending referrals to the person that left is that like, is a good networking group automatically cutting ties with that person? And they have to give to the new one, or, you know, you're talking about like, that does happen. So what do we do it?
Well, so a couple of things happen. dynamics and group shift, and change shape all the time, because the members become different. And what I have found and you know, managing, you know, this large as an organization is that people's schedules change, situations change. And in my organization, I allow people to switch groups, if the time and day just doesn't work for their schedule anymore, and their categories open, they're allowed to switch into something different.
There's no question that some of those relationships last, regardless of where people add, I like to say that in for VR, you will build relationships that will lead you for a lifetime, whether it's personally, professionally or both. And so some of those relationships that get established will laugh, but I often give example, and I use myself as an as an example, way back in time, I was in mortgage lending, and I was in a group representing a plan B, so not mortgage lending, but a plan B. And in that group, there was an insurance agent. And I was never going to personally give her my insurance business, because I insurance agent was a client of mine and my plan B. But I referred her all of my mortgage clients. And there was a realtor in that group. And obviously, I was a mortgage lender, so I was not going to refer him residential real estate clients, because I had realtors that supported me and I needed to support them. And that same realm, however, even even to this very day, and this has been, oh my gosh, 10 years ago, 12 years ago, I To this day, still refer him all of my commercial real estate client. And then obviously, there was a mortgage lender in the group, and she knew that I did mortgages, so I wasn't going to refer her business. But if there were ever any deals that I couldn't do, she's always who I referred to first. So I just always like to remind people that we're all people. And when it comes to who you're going to do business with, you are simply going to do business with who you choose. But we are a referral, a referral based organization, and there's plenty of business. And there are plenty of ways to figure out how to refer in all these different scenarios, even if it's not you personally. So it's being open to, you know, establishing a relationship getting to know them. And, you know, the thing I learned way back when and sales was that, you know, relationships are everywhere. And if there's somebody that you want to have a business relationship with a your best to recognize that they have a good established relationship with somebody else. And you're willing to be number two in line, things change, people move, they change careers, sometimes we have to be a little more patient than we would like. But I find when we approach it from a reasonable, you know, mentality that it works. And if the mindsets not reasonable, it really was never going to work anyway. That makes sense.
Justin Trosclair 25:01
Yeah, it definitely does. And what I'm gathering is, sometimes you really need a flesh out other ways to spread out your referrals, like you might, like you said, you might like this one firm, well, these firms can do everything, they could have realtors, mortgage insurance, and all that kind of stuff at you like No, I just send it to this person, they take care of everything you like, well, maybe pick one person, then pick some results and pick some results for different things. And it might be more work. But like you said to, if you can spread it out, that's even more relationships. And that's more of I gave to you. So at some point, you're probably going to feel obligated to give back to me, and now you've opened that pot wider, right? And I said it somebody leaves. Now you have no relationships with these with one one person. And when you could have had five, your own business could suffer.
And and you have you have personalities that are different, it's not most of us are not one size fits all, this person is going to get along better with this person, as opposed to this one. And it's being aware and knowing, you know, getting to know people and knowing, hey, I've got this person, and they're awesome. But these two people will not get along together, I you know, you know that. And if you try to push them together, then ultimately, nobody's happy in the end, everybody, nobody's happy with anybody, and you end up looking bad for trying to force that referral into a situation that was not best for the parties involved. So I think it takes a little bit of awareness. And you know, knowing that in most situations, it isn't one size fits all, and I you know, I try to be, I try to be that person, that's the resource. You know,
I'm very good at connecting people. And when people are looking and they have a need, I am often the person who gets the Facebook message, the text message, the email, the phone call that says, hey, I am looking for x, can you help me Who do you know, and that's too many people. True, but you know, it's, it's awesome to be able to fill that need. Because often when people are looking for something like that, they're kind of feeling a little desperate, like, it's an it's a need, it's not, oh, I, I want to find it. It's like, no, I need this, I really I have this need and being able to just, you know, be that person that people go to. That's gratifying for me. But I wouldn't have that if I didn't have the open mind going. No, I need to know this, many of you. And this many of you, and there's really not too many that I can know, because the situations are different. Now I can have a, you know, again, a great insurance agent, but if they need, you know, I'm somebody asked me for insurance in the market, they don't serve, then if I didn't have other resources, I was not able to help that person. Right. And, you know, understanding the value of again, that open mind and, you know, it's, it's the more you know, the more you can help people
Justin Trosclair 27:54
to the biggest, most common requests we see on Facebook, and are these chiropractic groups on part of is, who do you know, in this city? Who do you know? And it's a hard question, sometimes you don't know anybody. And if anybody has been a chiropractor, or even maybe physical therapist, you know, they run the gamut. Yeah, they might completely aligned with you, this person might just want, I just want to get my net cracked, I don't want rehab, I don't want to do all this stuff. Okay, well, that's the people I hang out with. So I don't really know who to refer you to. You got to go and find somebody. And I always like, because we're responsible. If you refer somebody, you kind of have some, like, kinda like a little bit of an obligation that there, they don't get injured or hurt from referral. So sometimes it's a little nerve wracking. Like, you know, what, let me give you a website or two, and you can find them on your own are a couple of choices. That way the person can call several people and be like, well as the vibe, and I kind of give them like questions like, you should ask these types of questions, and then use your gut or go visit all of them and then make a decision that way?
Justin Trosclair 28:57
One thing that you have to do, I'm sure you have to advertise or something, to get people to come to your meetings, and then they get impressed. And then they're like, Yes, I want to be a part of this, where can I go? What has been one of the top two ways that you've been able to market yourself to, to grow and expand.
It's interesting, because it's really changed since it started in 2010. And 2010, it was a lot of face to face, you know, attending, you know, all sorts of networking events and being you know, actively involved in my, you know, my Area Chamber of Commerce and that sort of thing. As you know, kind of things really kind of started taking shape and taking hold and gaining some steam, you know, the first thing I said was, I need an awesome website, and I'm looking at all these other groups, whether they're chambers or other networking groups, or referral groups, and I'm like, all our websites are horrible. They're just horrible. And they're not kept up to date. I mean, like, I would go to one again, this is I know, for a fact, this information, how I've been updated in over two years. So you know, the first thing I did was I set out to have a professional, interactive website that benefited my membership, and became a resource for others using it, that we're looking for products and services that they needed. So, you know, I started out with my website first. And, you know, then pretty soon into that realized, okay, I really need to work on SEO, because if I want to compete with these other well established companies, there's got to be a way for people to find me on the internet. So it was kind of that realization, always kept up with, you know, doing my, you know, my face to face stuff. And my networking, I did start hosting events. And that is another great way to get exposure for the type of organization that I have. So doing a do big quarterly networking events now that I'm doing.
Justin Trosclair 31:02
Yeah, I started doing the first one, I think I'm the first one was in 2011. And now I do want to quarter and average attendance as 125 150
people. And you know, I do those consistently every quarter, and that, that those numbers that remain consistent, you know, kind of then Facebook started coming into play. And, you know, that was a great place to interact and, you know, put up your business page and to do those sorts of things. But ultimately, what currently is the most successful for me, and a lot of organizations like mine is meetup has become very,
very accessible, very usable. It evolves. I often joke because I've had a love affair, love and hate affair with meetup. I joined it three times. So joined it twice, after twice. And then they really did some tweaking and all of a sudden, I started getting traction with meetup where it was really working. And now 90%, almost 95% of the guests that come and visit a for VR group that's established, found us through meetup or through my website. So that is wild, the internet presence has really changed how groups attract potential members. And it's becoming a real challenge groups are really struggling, I don't care what kind of group it is, they are having issues. And it's because the, you know, the old fashioned word of mouth, contact and invite people that you need to come visit your group just isn't done a lot anymore. It's I mean, I think that in I don't, again, I don't care if it's, you know, a big group or Chamber of Commerce group or some, you know, one off single group organization, they're struggling to get guests to their meetings. And I believe that it's just a mindset shift, that people just rely on the internet, it's kind of like, well, people are just going to google it anyway. So I don't need to invite anybody. And it's been an interesting thing to see. And I honestly think people are so busy, they have so many things to do in our tour in so many different directions. It's not that they don't want to invite, it's just never top of mind. And so, so I have, you know, really learned to kind of work with that shift. And really make sure that, you know, all the things are in place so that all my internet searching, you know, it's all coming together. You know, the meetup stuff pulls up with a for VR stuff pulls up with, you know, any advertising that I do and making sure that my messaging and my branding is all the same exactly in all those places, because then it all pulled together. When people do search, and they do search, they are using the internet. So every time I do a Facebook message that similar to what's in my meetup that similar to what's on my website, that all helps in my search engine rankings. And I'm, you know, I the numbers don't lie. I mean, it's all day and all night. I can look at any given group and I know a I track it. But I know where most of those guests come from, and they're coming from meetup.
Here in simple
Justin Trosclair 34:26
Are you find this is something that I didn't realize, because I mean, maybe I'm becoming old. But I felt like there was always a sliver of people that understood the value of networking groups.
Are you notice that he kind of made a comment, or university less people wanting to join these groups, because they're just like, I'll just go on Facebook and do the ads. And then they'll just come?
No, I think that people still see the value, but how they're choosing where they go, they're finding through the internet versus personal indications from Sam, a member in a group invited somebody to come visit as a guest. You know, that way, it always used to be done. And, you know, I just have seen a complete shift away from that. And even I mean, I have, I have members that are still a part of my organization that were there in 2010. So I mean, I have strong, long term members within my organization. And again, they're awesome people. But it's just not always top of mind when they meet somebody new, to invite them to come visit, because they're thinking about all the other things that are going on in their head. And that presence of mind isn't there. And so, you know, the the focus on those things that happened in internet searches are highly beneficial for what I do. And my you know, the events that I put on, you know, those are not meetup, prominent, those are more from all the social media work that I do with those events, as well. As you know, I kind of do a full court press 30 days out from an event where I'm everywhere I can possibly be letting people know, I've got an event coming. And people have heard of my events. So they're like, Oh, my gosh, I've heard of those, I think I can make it. And it's a two fold. But the internet's really been a big shift. I think, for most organizations, it's a change in how you find the new guests to come visit to gain the interest to get them to join.
Justin Trosclair 36:24
Well, that's good, because I remember when you first started out, it was difficult, like I don't really know too many people, and then already have my business connections, I don't really see why they need to join. If they're not, I'm not going to push them, like they're already set with me, I'm already set with them unless they don't see the value of coming to a meeting. So it's good to see that they can do that. Have you noticed any of the particular groups pain like Facebook as like, we really want a wedding photographer, we've never had one in the group, do the individual Facebook groups ever go on Facebook and like advertise straight up just for those are, it's more like the meetups,
I don't see ads advertising for it, I will see occasional posts.
But those, it's interesting, because they're not done. The organization if it's an organization that has multiple groups, so for me, you know, this is my business. And I'm not just a volunteer in a singular group, you know, trying to get more people. That's where I will see it, I will see some of those posts from individual groups or a member in an individual group that will do some posting like that. But I don't see the bigger networking organizations doing a lot to drive membership through those channels. I mean, I certainly do, because I know it works. But at the higher level where you know, people are paid to market or take care of things, those are just not directions that I really actively see. Doesn't mean a may not be out there. And I just know not, you know, connected to them, or not online at the moment with this post come through. But I don't see the paid advertising like that. One thing I've noticed
Justin Trosclair 38:09
is that people will complain that there's a fee involved. It's $300. Oh, it's $500 for a year, why I gotta pay some money to be a part of a networking group? What's your answer to that?
Well, my answer to that is and always will be, what you see is what you get and free is free. And that means there's sell them anything worth structure. Nobody has any skin in the game. So you know, what if I wake up and I have a hangnail, and I don't feel like going today, I'm not going to go.
Free, it's free. And you know, free is not always the best way to go. And you know, free is what you get is just is just kind of how I see it. When I put for VR together, you know, my whole thing was I been in all these groups, I've been in the free ones, I've been in the expensive ones, I've been in between ones, the ones that need every other week, we want to meet once a month, I mean, I've been in all this stuff. And my goal was really to put together something that was different that created value for the time and money you invested in your membership. And that is you know, kind of where our shift has been on personal and professional development. Because I feel that if people are going to pay money, a they deserve a professional who is committed for running the best business, the best group platform with the best content. And they're, they're committed to it, it's the business and it's not a hobby.
And I've put that together and people see value in that. That's why they're willing to join and there they want to pay because they know they're going to get professional training, they're going to get personal development, they have all the advantages with them my organization because of the different things that we do that they're happy to pay. And I am also happy to say if you don't find value in that my organization isn't for everyone. And if you want something free, it's out there. And I wish you the best.
My organization, you know, we focused and we want members who want to improve themselves and who want to be better business professionals. And when you're working and again, that like mindedness where you're all wanting the same things for yourself and one another, your business relationships are different.
Justin Trosclair 40:37
So you actually go through simple not meant to be simple. But you know, you might go through something like, okay, here's your 10 minute presentation this week, you guys have really been horrible lately. So let's go through and and you know, he may be like, here's a better way to do a presentation, especially in this atmosphere to get the best results. And the most entertaining for the other members. Like there's like a process that you would be able to teach. There's something like that.
Yep. And we go through refresher courses to on different things. Because, you know, people do get into habits, habits and patterns, and they start to get lazy. And you know, that's kind of funny, I, I'm a preacher of guests, make your world go round. Guests in a group make your 32nd commercials tight, they make your presentations better, they keep you on your feet for networking skills, because you have an opportunity to put yourself in your business in front of a guest. And you want to look good, right? Your business professional, you want more business, you want to make more connection. So we'll definitely work to clean those things up. And you know, we do, we'll do q amp a, because it's great to have the opportunity to do a 15 minute presentation. But if you're speaking to people about things, they have no interest in knowing their engagement in your presentation is typically not going to be what it should be. Yeah, true. You know, so we love to give people and we were across the board, personal professional, we talked about it all. Again, the more we know about one another, the better off we all all our for referral sources. And we give them those questions. But you know, occasionally you'll get people who kind of get in a rut, and they'll just stand there and go, well, somebody asked this, and somebody asked that. So And my answer to this question is, and what we like to help our members do is learn to develop a presentation around the questions. So that there there's a flow to their presentation. And it makes sense based on the way it's presented instead of just being a bunch of random answers and a random facts that are just kind of shot back and forth. And when somebody asks you a question the week before they're waiting for your presentation, because they want your answer. it's it's it's engaging with your audience at, you know, a very personal level. And, you know, occasionally, if people aren't working on a presentation style around those questions, they don't know if that presentation is going to be 15 minutes long. Is it going to be eight? Is it going to be 20? And, you know, so not everybody quite polishes that. And you know, somebody will not get a question answered, and they'll be like, hey, you didn't answer my question. Like they're hurt, they want to know, you know, I had a question for you that I wanted an answer to, you know, so it's, we, you know, we definitely work on the policy polishing of the presentations, I would say we do that probably about every nine months or so really kind of work on, you know, getting everybody back to that clean, well informed, polished style. And you know, it's a great, it's a great experience, when you do it over and over and over again, you get better and you get better and you get better. And you know, that's just a good skill to have, wherever you may be, because you don't ever know when you're going to find yourself with that opportunity to be on stage. And to be able to talk for a little bit about your business. And practice makes perfect in those scenarios.
Justin Trosclair 44:05
Well, that's huge, because I can tell you, we typically will have a canned speech that we could just give, but it doesn't always really fit with the audience. And I'm a big fan of like, what does the audience want to know? What's their pain points, so I can tailor it to them. And if you're part of a group like this, after a couple q amp a sessions, you might find like, that's actually what the lay person the normal person would have a question about, especially when you're talking about like, I mean, a doctor and be one of these groups. This is what you want to know about you. That was the easy stuff you like, no, that's the part that we don't have a clue about or misunderstood. So then when you go to say, a bigger organization, you could have a better presentation where you already answered these questions that you know, the normal person is going to have. And you might go to, quote, close more in the room to schedule an appointment or whatever. That's huge.
Yeah, it's funny, I, you know, we do monthly mastermind roundtables, and that's an opportunity for members to, you know, step up and facilitate a roundtable conversation around something that they have expertise, specialty knowledge, you know, it's kind of their thing. And it gives them the experience to handle questions on the fly and things that they don't encounter, you know, really almost ever. And so it's a great way to learn in a safe environment, because it's a bunch of members. But it just really again, another way you can help hone your skill, because they don't, the only way you get better at it is by doing it more and more.
Justin Trosclair 45:36
Very good. Well, we got a couple minutes, let's switch gears, always like to ask these questions. Okay. You're busy person, you've got spouses, you've got kids, you've got this big organization you're having to manage? Are you able to take vacation? If you're not, how can you take a few more.
So the beauty of that is that I in my career, have been a time management freak. And, you know, it's kind of I mean, to the extent that, you know, my calendars are color coded, and the thing that I learned a long time ago, and, you know, working 80 plus hours, and, you know, having a family and all of this is that, if I don't schedule my own personal time, I will take that personal time, at a time when it may not be most beneficial for my business or for my family.
So by recognizing that, no, I need time with my spouse, or I need time for myself and just, that's like the first time that I schedule on my calendar. And like, Dave, my husband, and I, you know, we'll sit down, and we would just call it calendaring up, we do it once a week where we just sit down and make sure we know what we've got going on. And we get our personal time in there so that we know, all right, hey, we're going to go where I go kayaking, you know, this afternoon, and we're going to do you know that on Sunday afternoon, or whatever, because we both work from home, I can work all the time, I can work 24 hours a day, there's always plenty to do, whether it's laundry or lawn work or you know, work work, you know, anything, you can zoom 24 hours a day with things to do. And I just know from experience that if I don't schedule that time, and I don't schedule the breaks, all of a sudden, long weekends going to get pushed in. And it may mean that I didn't even leave the house. But none of the things that needed to get done got done, because I've been working way too much in front of that. And, you know, human nature just says Nope, I'm done. I'm taking a break. I don't care. And so we've, you know, really, over the many years now have been super disciplined at going. This is our scheduled time, you know, and you know, not always doing family vacations, meaning our families all out of state going to visit family, because that's not always the vacation often up a lot of work. It can be you know, so it's going okay, well, if we're going to do the family visit than where what are we going to do for our personal visit? And so we've been really disciplined about doing that. And it's just through our own experience of going, Wow, I guess we just blew off the afternoon, but we've worked for the last 14 days straight. So if you structure it a little more cleanly into you know, smaller chunks of time and you know, making sure then you're you're taking that time out for family, we just find that it works well that way. And I I don't think I would function at the level that I function at if I weren't doing that.
Justin Trosclair 48:47
I really liked that idea. I don't think I've heard that yet in 70 something episodes, that makes sense. Because if you're both those kinds of people that can work all the time, like you said, If you schedule it, it's going to get done. Otherwise, like you said, it could be 10 days, and one person is feeling really neglected. And the other ones like well, you know, I've been really busy. And now you've actually said no, this day, in this day, twice a week, these are the times that we have to spend together. And your happiness you're happy with like, this is what the minimum This is the minimum that I will feel loved and cherished. And if you end up having to work all the rest of that time that week, you can still feel like my love think school. And I'm looking at you.
Well, and that's exactly it. And it's totally, you know, it is that scenario, it's like you will, you will get your stuff done. So you can have that time. And it changes your your focus and your commitment. And it, you know, we have found for us that it works it works very, very well. I like that,
Justin Trosclair 49:47
typically these days is popular to have a morning routine or a lunch routine to focus you for the rest of the day. Do you have one of those?
Yes. So funny. So I always I always think preface an answer like this with the fact that I am extremely spoiled. My husband brings me coffee in bed almost every single day of the week. And, you know, that's our, you know, he and I that's kind of like, you know, first cup of coffee in the morning is pretty much over silence but you know, we're awake, work together, we're having coffee, you know, and then kind of from there, you know, conversation starts, then we're talking about, you know, whatever it could be business, it could be family, you know, could be the upcoming vacation or worry or whatever it is.
And then, you know, Dave typically has some stuff that's a little earlier in the day, then I have in my schedule. And so he will typically, you know, he's got he's in the shower, and then, you know, I actually spend a little time just kind of perusing the news and what's going on. Because I talked to so many people through the course of the day and a week, I like to kind of just be up on current events so that I can be conversational intelligently. Know, you know, I spent a little time doing that, and then I'll be like, Okay, done, you know, now it's time to go make breakfast. And we almost always eat breakfast together every morning. So one of us, you know, takes the responsibility to cook and you know, we have, we don't do cereal and our house or bagels, you know, we do the eggs and spinach and avocado and all the things that are good for you know, so we have our kind of our morning routine runs about 90 minutes, but it's really what centers me for the day and lets me go, Okay, I got all my me stuff in taking care of and now I'm ready to go out and tackle the day. And it's tough when I'm in situations where I don't get that time in. And you know, I really, that becomes a real challenge for me, my dad has been ill. And I've been going back and forth to Florida to take care of him and with the time difference and trying to juggle all of his stuff. And then the time difference in my you know, my morning routine that I just, I don't get and then I feel I actually feel deprived really weird. So you know that time in the morning is super, super important to me.
Justin Trosclair 52:06
That's awesome. Have you heard of the skin?
I have not.
Justin Trosclair 52:10
Okay, it's a it's one of the ways I keep up with current events. It's actually like it's written by I guess a couple of ladies, they're really tongue in cheek. Sometimes they're funny. And it gives me all the current events without having to like browse being or Google for like an hour. It's really cool. It's just a simple email, you get all the current stuff that actually kind of mattered for the day. Like you said, Yeah, like, you know, if I got to talk to a client real quick and be like, Oh, yeah, did you hear about the North Korean prisoners getting released this week? Like, yeah, I did hear that you like Yeah, me too. Great. Alright, perfect. bonded. Somebody real quick. Yeah, it. Somebody said that before. And I was like, I don't remember that. It's been good. Anyway, you happen to have a favorite app, our blog, or something that you use on a regular basis that you just secretly love? And one that you would definitely share for others? A book as well.
I wish I had a good answer to that question.
Because as much as I live in the technology world, I don't, I don't use a lot of stuff on my phone outside of functionality for Facebook and things like that. And a lot of that is, is really work driven. You know, I definitely love to read, probably my favorite book ever is the magic of thinking big. And I've, I literally have read that book. So often that I had to take, I should just go buy a new one, right, Becky, I love used books, when they've been used for a purpose, I had to take like, not duct tape, but you know, like the clarity, and team over the cover and stuff because it was coming off of the book. And it was just a mess. You know,
but just always, I like to I like to have my thinking expanded into, you know, you're saying or somebody like, you know, you're just not thinking big enough. And there's so much out there. And just to have that reminder that, man, there's a lot out there, and you never know what the next thing coming could be. And so just feel that you live in a world of expansion and that you can be ready when that time comes, for whatever reason, and whatever it may be. You know, it just is I don't know, I think it's just a mindset. It's not, you know, living in limited belief thinking and scarcity thinking and going, you know, oh, what was me this is all there is, you know,
to be reminded, and sometimes you need that reminder. You know, you know, you think you live that way. But all of a sudden, on occasion, you could find that you just, you know, kind of got caught up in the stuff. And you kind of lost your bigger sense of vision, and your bigger sense of the world. So I always like to remind myself that, which is why the book is so used,
Justin Trosclair 54:57
what was one of the bigger hurdles that you've had had to overcome with for Br. You know,
it's interesting, you talked about chambers, and, you know, a challenge that I and I will still have this challenge. It just depends on people are people, and we all have our mindsets and misconceptions and preconceived notions. And a big challenge that I've had, especially early on, was that a lot of the chambers saw me as competition. And, and and you know, what, what I do is nothing like what they do. So they have leads groups and their leads, groups, the leads groups, what I'm doing is just something that's completely different. So that was definitely a challenge early on, and like I said, can still be a challenge occasionally. Now, I think that I've made good inroads, and I've done a lot of collaborations with some of the chambers. So we really collaborated on events and support, you know, kind of one another and that sort of thing. So that's been good. And I think the word is, you know, well out on that, that, you know, know what you do and what she does are not the same thing. And but you know, a challenge is a challenge. And when new people come in, and you kind of have, you know, changing and, you know, management and people running things, you know, you can still kind of run into that some of that stuff. And I find it easiest just to, you know, schedule a sit down and have the conversation so that, you know, it doesn't become that issue down the road, sort of the thing that, you know, I'm here to support you, I support chambers. Across the board, we talked about chamber events and all of our meetings on a weekly basis. So if you think I'm not have that mindset, I support what you do. And I encourage my members to be involved in other things, whether they're chambers or other networking opportunities that are out there. You know, I always say one thing can't be your end all be all, you've got to do a little bit of a few different things in order to have a good strategy to help grow your business and get your message out there. Need.
Justin Trosclair 57:06
Well, how can people find out all about for BR and Miss Urbach?
Well, it's super easy to go to our website, which gives you a whole bunch of information that website is four b r dot biz. Is that a number? Or is it spelled out? Now? It is the number for capital B capital r.biz.di. d? Yes. And just so you know, I am already at a point where I'm ready to ship for VR and a mock. So I am ready to open in my other markets. So wait, wait, so you're telling me
Justin Trosclair 57:41
if I moved back to America, and then was like, I would like to start my own mega empire of networking groups? I could do that.
Justin Trosclair 57:54
Is there but I spy just not asked that question. contract.
I'm like, wait, I have a piece of this pie. Like that's kind of cool. I'm really on board with this whole process. I really think it's an amazing thing. And I don't have to start from scratch.
Like the term that sounds reasonable. It's turnkey. So yeah, that you just wait for somebody to reach me on that is just the hit me up with an email at Tammy ga and then why app for VR. been awesome to have the conversation.
Justin Trosclair 58:25
That is fantastic. Thank you so much for being on the show. And spending your time with us today
are welcome. This is awesome. It was great fun, Justin. Alrighty.
Justin Trosclair 58:36
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